That’s a good starting point since the citizenship count is much lower at this time it would be more feasible logistically and I would limit the number of proposals at the final stage to 25. Unless they are doing a complete rewrite in which case each section would be a simple up or down vote regardless of the number of sections.
Yeah it does seem safer to have fewer final options that could get implemented, and your proposal of 25 is probably better than 50. I was trying to find numbers where every citizen could enter an idea in, but I probably guessed high.
If there was 800 proposals to change the Florida Constitution in 2017 with a population of 21 million, then about 1 out of 26000 citizens submitted a change proposal. Now of course LL will be much higher, it might be 1 out of 100. So in LL, for 10000 citizens there would only be 100 ideas to consider and vote on, and could probably be accomplished in 2 weekends of voting.
Glad we’re on the same page I think if something really egregious or some unexpected constitutional crises were to occur in the interim there needs to be method of invoking a convention. Quorums seem to be the ultimate handicap that occurs in a more globally spread out community like Liberland so I am not sure what the threshold would be for a petition to become a valid instrument for a convention to begin in between the 10 year time frame.
Yes I can see this happening if during the regular convention, something idiotic is passed into the constitution and then a few years down the line, the citizens realize how idiotic it really is and want to change it back.
I strongly dislike the standard in-person petition method because people simply don’t interact with each other in the same way. Maybe there can be an online petition method, perhaps similar to change.org but part of the official govt website.
Well it doesn’t have to be that extreme we want experimentation, innovation, new bold ideas and if something on paper looks like it would work but then it doesn’t function in the way that was intended to then there is a way to remedy the problem.
Liberland’s blockchain already has a built in petition system if people wish to use however it has at this time never been used but it is there for the people to use if they so choose to.
Do you have a link to that?
Good on them for having that.
However, I do feel that stuff like this is only useful if everything stays publicly visible. All submitted proposals should be publicly visible or it just goes to some bureaucrats inbox and is ignored. If it remains visible, then at least it can get up-voted by other citizens and build some momentum.
I don’t know the exact parameters for how many people have to sign the petition but it bypasses all of the red tape and is automatically voted on by the people
The LL one does? Then we should surely be the ones to test that process? My bet is that absolutely nothing occurs, but I would gladly be wrong.
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Since receiving citizenship I have considered doing submitting a proposal but for me it is more about which draft law that I have written so I put forward or do I start with something more innocuous like a national symbol or the retroactive approval of the April 13, 2015 Declaration of Independence that President Vit Jedlicka made creating Liberland.
Whichever action someone takes now would make any proposal the first ever popularly initiated proposal in the history of Liberland and will be forever written into the blockchain and in history books in the future. As an avid student of history I will say that whatever proposal is brought forward first, it must be a measure that will pass as history always looks at the successful votes of the past, not the failed ones unless that vote was bizarre in some way like a 1795 motion in the US House that failed by 1 vote which would have required all federal documents to be published in both German and English for example.
I send you a hearty “Hear hear!” towards submitting the first proposal! I’m sure you will figure out just the right thing to propose.
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I appreciate the enthusiasm I feel for now this is the only viable solution to get around an inactive Congress.
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I’m thinking that in addition to a constitutional convention every 10 years, there should be an opportunity to re-create the foundational “law and order” institutions. These institutions include: the police, court system, and prison system.
When I was researching for my police system, I continually saw remarks from critics of police depts that said that the police should have a way of responding to non-criminal calls besides sending a police officer who is trained to deal with crime. So everyone had the same critique of police systems across the world, and yet, to date, none of these systems can fix this problem. This is because to fix it means to completely re-write the entire structure of a police dept and no head of any police dept is willing to do this because he is a politician and politicians always protect their own future career.
So it simply makes sense to give the creative citizens an opportunity to completely re-write these institutions every ten years. Maybe we can change the name from “constitutional convention” to “citizens convention"? And then this citizen’s convention can include submitting ideas to change the constitution, police, courts, and/or prisons.
Of course, LL needs to switch to “one-person-one-vote” to make any of this work. The current corrupt “meritocracy” can only support elitism.
Well I do like the idea of a citizen’s convention as the subject areas would be quite broad. I think ad-hoc committees should be the norm as they were during the American revolutionary period up until the us constitution (that’s how Article V conventions were supposed to function, but once the feds got their power they never looked back). If we look at these committees now I would see them as SME’s in a particular area maybe even bringing forward referendums in the interim as they find new ways to innovate a particular need such as law enforcement or judicial reforms for example. We need to somehow get a handle on what everyone’s talents/backgrounds are that are LL citizens and eresidents first and then expand from there to others who are pro freedom and want to see a new society formed that will be maximum freedom and very limited government, I think this is the only that a new society can truly be created from scratch.
That’s very interesting about Article V conventions. I think I’m going to have to change course and just read the whole US Constitution all the way thru. It’s too interesting to leave til the end.
Yeah I wonder if either LL citizens have slowly lost interest in doing work for LL because it has been so many years and LL is not even close to occupying its land, or the other possibility is that LL citizens (generally) just think that paying $10K for a passport is them contributing to LL, and they don’t have to contribute anything on top of that. Don’t they realize that if citizens could occupy the land right now, there aren’t systems in place to protect anyone? And for the systems to exist, someone has to take pen to paper?